Can anyone tell or give me an exact list of spec differences between 1,3s and 1,3HF? (2nd series)
I mean, what changes should be done to make an HF-clone?
..May be some link with all technical differences of all models or smth..
Thank You!!
1,3s to 1,3HF
1,3s to 1,3HF
Hi, all!
Can anyone tell or give me an exact list of spec differences between 1,3s and 1,3HF? (2nd series)
I mean, what changes should be done to make an HF-clone?
..May be some link with all technical differences of all models or smth..
Thank You!!
Can anyone tell or give me an exact list of spec differences between 1,3s and 1,3HF? (2nd series)
I mean, what changes should be done to make an HF-clone?
..May be some link with all technical differences of all models or smth..
Thank You!!
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
LOL Thanks!
..Then, what was the S1 difference?
Thanks!..Then, what was the S1 difference?
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
There are too many differences to list here. I'd suggest you get a copy of the Fulvia S1 parts catalogue (available on CD).
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gamma a.i.
- Posts: 888
- Joined: 23 Dec 2008, 14:18
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
good morning from Heidelberg:
since there was never an S2 HF, you can as you wish go "skys the limit" & you will always be historically accurate...or not ? (ha ha) .
Seriously, why would you want to creat a HF from a perfectly-good already historically-correct & beautiful Fulvia ?
I will ask Racing the same question as long as I am here...
Racing: why are you going to the great-effort/expanse of creating a Daytona Racing FSZ Clone from your standard FSZ ? if you reply "because I want to! " that is certainly OK by me...not that that matters
since there was never an S2 HF, you can as you wish go "skys the limit" & you will always be historically accurate...or not ? (ha ha) .
Seriously, why would you want to creat a HF from a perfectly-good already historically-correct & beautiful Fulvia ?
I will ask Racing the same question as long as I am here...
Racing: why are you going to the great-effort/expanse of creating a Daytona Racing FSZ Clone from your standard FSZ ? if you reply "because I want to! " that is certainly OK by me...not that that matters
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
and this is myn
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Lancia Delta 3 en Fulvia Zagato 1401 `72 , ex.(Kappa coupe 2.4 enYpsilon 2002 .Fulvia coupe, berline, beta coupe ,beta spider , 2000 coupe ,Delta hpe1999)
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lucasgeheniau
- Posts: 653
- Joined: 17 Dec 2008, 20:12
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
Mmmmmm. Very nice car, will we see her at the September FFF Viva-Lancia meet? I do hope so. Gina has a new MOT so she will be qualified for the next two years. Berlina's are getting more rare.
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
Why do´t you asked before. No Problem to explain it.
First : My opinion is, it´s not a clone of a Daytona Racing FSZ from a standard FSZ.
It is a modification by my "own spec." I do what i like and disclaim what i don´t like.
It is like ED said there are so many detail what make the difference respect to a HF ( or a Daytona)
Example, if you want install a 1,6 engine you have to use a first series one to have a Daytona spec.
I have a 1,6l second serie´s engine and i am not sure to install it in this Z undepent of original or not.
Maybe i will add. the 1,3 as it was in the car.
Also the gearbox. Dont have a fivespeed first serie but i can use a fourspeed first or fivespeed second serie´s
By the way, i build up an adapter to use the driveshaft second serie´s also with the fourspeed firstserie´s
`
And so on.
The cage : If you see the front bodystructure of this car you have to accept it or to improve the safety behavior
to stay a life after a front crash. ( don´t hope that it happend )
Second : I have a second serie´s FSZ in original condition´s
third : I like the shape
I try to keep as much as possible from the old substance. I was a long time in doubt with the flared wheel arches.
But i decide to do it.( I have had pain when i cut the old wheel arches, believe me .)
On the other hand a lot of Fulvia`s have flared wheel arches. Are they Fanalone´s or 1,3 HF or Daytonas.
Fore sure not. But the owner´s like it.
Look at the pic . from Koos. He has the front lamps like a Daytona but is it a Daytona?By the way it look´s good
but i will keep the serie´s one.
Comming to the end i have to summarize that i build it up for my own challenge.Not more and not less
Regards Andreas
First : My opinion is, it´s not a clone of a Daytona Racing FSZ from a standard FSZ.
It is a modification by my "own spec." I do what i like and disclaim what i don´t like.
It is like ED said there are so many detail what make the difference respect to a HF ( or a Daytona)
Example, if you want install a 1,6 engine you have to use a first series one to have a Daytona spec.
I have a 1,6l second serie´s engine and i am not sure to install it in this Z undepent of original or not.
Maybe i will add. the 1,3 as it was in the car.
Also the gearbox. Dont have a fivespeed first serie but i can use a fourspeed first or fivespeed second serie´s
By the way, i build up an adapter to use the driveshaft second serie´s also with the fourspeed firstserie´s
`And so on.
The cage : If you see the front bodystructure of this car you have to accept it or to improve the safety behavior
to stay a life after a front crash. ( don´t hope that it happend )
Second : I have a second serie´s FSZ in original condition´s
third : I like the shape
I try to keep as much as possible from the old substance. I was a long time in doubt with the flared wheel arches.
But i decide to do it.( I have had pain when i cut the old wheel arches, believe me .)
On the other hand a lot of Fulvia`s have flared wheel arches. Are they Fanalone´s or 1,3 HF or Daytonas.
Fore sure not. But the owner´s like it.
Look at the pic . from Koos. He has the front lamps like a Daytona but is it a Daytona?By the way it look´s good
but i will keep the serie´s one.
Comming to the end i have to summarize that i build it up for my own challenge.Not more and not less
Regards Andreas
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- img_0195.jpg (59.41 KiB) Viewed 1048 times
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gamma a.i.
- Posts: 888
- Joined: 23 Dec 2008, 14:18
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
My reply to Andreas is: WUNDERBAR WONDERFUL GREAT GOOD FOR YOU !!
I have been excitedly following this link in VL & in other Lancia Forums for (it seems) ever !!
we* very much look forward to our planned stop in Alte-Koeln on 13 Sep AM* in order to meet the Artisan himself & to see this rolling "self-made" FSZ individual Work of Art; however we willn't arrive in redwhiteblus S2 FSZ . It will stay home.
however on 7-0 Sep - 1 week before the Cologne-Zip-Visit - we will drive/ride in a redwhiteblus S2 FSZ to Alsace to be togetheragain with the Benelux & More Fulvia Hoard.
For the Köln trip we'll enjoy (we pray) our smoothly-running comfortable-quiet Gamma enroute to Kerkrade NL - Ostende BE - Dover - Enfield to arrive at the yearly Gamma-Meeting in Buckingham.
Return is by a similar route, but we may enjoy some different highways & byways.
* details of Köln visit are still to be coordinated; as the departure date comes closer
NOTE OF IMPORTANCE:
actually M isn't really very excited to "fach-complicated / wax-elequent" about any FSZ nor any other older car; Lancia, Fulvia, Gamma or otherwise....at any Meeting anywhere anytime. She attends Lancia Meetings for the warmth / friendlyness of our Lancia Friends & - of course - for the Culture !
she will also not ever drive (her choice) a FSZ or any other Fulvia ! worse things may never happen to our FSZ (says me) than someone / anyone who isn't already Fulvia-familiar to drive our FSZ or any other Fulvia - ever - anywhere other than in a straight-line for a long time.
Perhaps it is only our FSZ, perhaps not. I do not know; I've never driven another Fulvia !
Those personswho are accustomed to driving only much more-modern-cars have a very hard time driving (shifting, steering, braking) our FSZ.
Several persons who otherwise drive well (in their own cars)(actually everyone) who have tried to drive our FSZ have asked me "how can you like this car; why do you even own this car; it is loud, it requires great concentration & muscle to drive; it is awful small inside. I smile as I reply " U R Rite!!!
I will go on record to say that M drives our Gamma as well as she drives her own French GT (too fast for my nerves); as was proven with her "no-trouble" on-track-laps at the 2012 Ital Car Meet in Spa Francochamp.
On the UK Gamma via Cologne trip she will Gamma along all the long-passages & I will sleep !!!
In UK - so I've been informed - I will drive !
I have been excitedly following this link in VL & in other Lancia Forums for (it seems) ever !!
we* very much look forward to our planned stop in Alte-Koeln on 13 Sep AM* in order to meet the Artisan himself & to see this rolling "self-made" FSZ individual Work of Art; however we willn't arrive in redwhiteblus S2 FSZ . It will stay home.
however on 7-0 Sep - 1 week before the Cologne-Zip-Visit - we will drive/ride in a redwhiteblus S2 FSZ to Alsace to be togetheragain with the Benelux & More Fulvia Hoard.
For the Köln trip we'll enjoy (we pray) our smoothly-running comfortable-quiet Gamma enroute to Kerkrade NL - Ostende BE - Dover - Enfield to arrive at the yearly Gamma-Meeting in Buckingham.
Return is by a similar route, but we may enjoy some different highways & byways.
* details of Köln visit are still to be coordinated; as the departure date comes closer
NOTE OF IMPORTANCE:
actually M isn't really very excited to "fach-complicated / wax-elequent" about any FSZ nor any other older car; Lancia, Fulvia, Gamma or otherwise....at any Meeting anywhere anytime. She attends Lancia Meetings for the warmth / friendlyness of our Lancia Friends & - of course - for the Culture !
she will also not ever drive (her choice) a FSZ or any other Fulvia ! worse things may never happen to our FSZ (says me) than someone / anyone who isn't already Fulvia-familiar to drive our FSZ or any other Fulvia - ever - anywhere other than in a straight-line for a long time.
Perhaps it is only our FSZ, perhaps not. I do not know; I've never driven another Fulvia !
Those personswho are accustomed to driving only much more-modern-cars have a very hard time driving (shifting, steering, braking) our FSZ.
Several persons who otherwise drive well (in their own cars)(actually everyone) who have tried to drive our FSZ have asked me "how can you like this car; why do you even own this car; it is loud, it requires great concentration & muscle to drive; it is awful small inside. I smile as I reply " U R Rite!!!
I will go on record to say that M drives our Gamma as well as she drives her own French GT (too fast for my nerves); as was proven with her "no-trouble" on-track-laps at the 2012 Ital Car Meet in Spa Francochamp.
On the UK Gamma via Cologne trip she will Gamma along all the long-passages & I will sleep !!!
In UK - so I've been informed - I will drive !
Re: 1,3s to 1,3HF
Hi Savant, i take place in that interesting chat
First, sorry for my english, I am french
Your question comes back frequently
As you can guess, it is not easy to answer, because changes are numerous but generally "little things"
I asked the same question some years ago on this forum in french, and got some informations back, that I give back now
There are two categories :
1) more strenght by working on engine (pistons, light fly wheel, admission....)
2) save weight by using light parts : plexiglass windows, deposit door panels, and carpets....
Now here are the informations that I collected from
"gil.bourdon"
and
"SFERIC"
Dés la sortie du coupé Fulvia originel 1200 (818130), Lancia a développé en parallèle la lignée des modèles sportifs HF en commençant par la 1200HF (818140) 1966
pour se terminer par l'emblématique 1600HF (818540) 1969
Ces modèles sportifs étaient disponibles en version "civile" via le réseau courant ,
soit en version "compétition client" via le Reparto Corse avec un panel d'options de plus en plus large, au choix selon l'usage (et le budget) prévu par le compétiteur.
Les évolutions ultimes restant réservées a la compétition "Usine".
Votre question : En 1967 où en était ce développement?
Comparons donc le coupé Rallye 1300 (818330) et la 1300HF (818340) civile.
A ce stade, les améliorations ne sont encore que :
Moteur plus puissant / allègement
87cv à 6000 tours/ 960kg contre 101cv à 6400tours/825kg
Rapports de boite, géométrie de suspensions, freinage, pneumatiques sont strictement identiques.
La préparation effectuée sur le moteur comprend essentiellement :
- Taux de compression 10,5 au lieu de 9.5 (pistons bombés)
- Bielles allégées / équilibrées
- Vilebrequin nitruré /équilibré
- Volant moteur allégé.
- Arbres à cames spécifiques (+ de levée)/distribution spécifique.
- Conduits d'admission polis
- Radiateur d'huile (like 1300 S Rallye)
L'allégement de la structure comprend essentiellement :
- Suppression des pare-chocs
- Ouvrants (capot, malle, portes) en alu (like 1300 S Rallye)
- Pas d'insonorisant intérieur
- Sellerie sommaire
- Vitre AR et custodes en plexi
- Fusées d'essieu AR en alu (like 1300 S Rallye
Compte tenu de l'allègement le tarage des ressorts à lames AV et AR est spécifique.
Cordialement Gil Lancia Club France
Date: 24-01-06 23:33
Bonjour,
Le numéro identifiant le moteur est celui situé sur la cloche d'embrayage, au niveau du nez de démarreur. Pour une 1300HF (818340), le numéro moteur est 818342 suivi du n° de série qui n'est pas nécessairement le même que celui de l'auto, surtout pour les 1300HF de la "2 tranche" (1404 à 2089) dont votre auto est issue. Malheureusement cette cloche d'embrayage est une piéce qui peut être remplacée.....donc le doute est possible.
Quelques observations pour être sûr d'avoir bien affaire à un 818342 :
- sonde de prise de T° d'huile (sur fonderie supportant le filtre à huile)
- 818342 gravé sur arbres à cames.
- conduits pipe d'admission polis
- pistons bombés
- vilebrequin nitruré
- etc
Les autres n° pouvant être trouvés ici ou là désignent l'origine du modéle où cette pièce (la fonderie) est apparue pour la première fois. Donc rien d'anormal à trouver du 818303 ou 818140 pour la culasse par exemple.
Pour la boite de vitesses, la monte sur une 1300HF standard, est un couple conique de 10/37 et même rapports que la Rallye 1,3 818330. Rien d'anormal donc.
Les couples optionnels (7x41, 9x41.....etc) pour usage sportif sont signalés par une plaque en bronze (pincée avec une fixation des 2 demis carters a proximité du levier d'embrayage)
Cordialement
Gil
Lancia Club France
First, sorry for my english, I am french
Your question comes back frequently
As you can guess, it is not easy to answer, because changes are numerous but generally "little things"
I asked the same question some years ago on this forum in french, and got some informations back, that I give back now
There are two categories :
1) more strenght by working on engine (pistons, light fly wheel, admission....)
2) save weight by using light parts : plexiglass windows, deposit door panels, and carpets....
Now here are the informations that I collected from
"gil.bourdon"
and
"SFERIC"
Dés la sortie du coupé Fulvia originel 1200 (818130), Lancia a développé en parallèle la lignée des modèles sportifs HF en commençant par la 1200HF (818140) 1966
pour se terminer par l'emblématique 1600HF (818540) 1969
Ces modèles sportifs étaient disponibles en version "civile" via le réseau courant ,
soit en version "compétition client" via le Reparto Corse avec un panel d'options de plus en plus large, au choix selon l'usage (et le budget) prévu par le compétiteur.
Les évolutions ultimes restant réservées a la compétition "Usine".
Votre question : En 1967 où en était ce développement?
Comparons donc le coupé Rallye 1300 (818330) et la 1300HF (818340) civile.
A ce stade, les améliorations ne sont encore que :
Moteur plus puissant / allègement
87cv à 6000 tours/ 960kg contre 101cv à 6400tours/825kg
Rapports de boite, géométrie de suspensions, freinage, pneumatiques sont strictement identiques.
La préparation effectuée sur le moteur comprend essentiellement :
- Taux de compression 10,5 au lieu de 9.5 (pistons bombés)
- Bielles allégées / équilibrées
- Vilebrequin nitruré /équilibré
- Volant moteur allégé.
- Arbres à cames spécifiques (+ de levée)/distribution spécifique.
- Conduits d'admission polis
- Radiateur d'huile (like 1300 S Rallye)
L'allégement de la structure comprend essentiellement :
- Suppression des pare-chocs
- Ouvrants (capot, malle, portes) en alu (like 1300 S Rallye)
- Pas d'insonorisant intérieur
- Sellerie sommaire
- Vitre AR et custodes en plexi
- Fusées d'essieu AR en alu (like 1300 S Rallye
Compte tenu de l'allègement le tarage des ressorts à lames AV et AR est spécifique.
Cordialement Gil Lancia Club France
Date: 24-01-06 23:33
Bonjour,
Le numéro identifiant le moteur est celui situé sur la cloche d'embrayage, au niveau du nez de démarreur. Pour une 1300HF (818340), le numéro moteur est 818342 suivi du n° de série qui n'est pas nécessairement le même que celui de l'auto, surtout pour les 1300HF de la "2 tranche" (1404 à 2089) dont votre auto est issue. Malheureusement cette cloche d'embrayage est une piéce qui peut être remplacée.....donc le doute est possible.
Quelques observations pour être sûr d'avoir bien affaire à un 818342 :
- sonde de prise de T° d'huile (sur fonderie supportant le filtre à huile)
- 818342 gravé sur arbres à cames.
- conduits pipe d'admission polis
- pistons bombés
- vilebrequin nitruré
- etc
Les autres n° pouvant être trouvés ici ou là désignent l'origine du modéle où cette pièce (la fonderie) est apparue pour la première fois. Donc rien d'anormal à trouver du 818303 ou 818140 pour la culasse par exemple.
Pour la boite de vitesses, la monte sur une 1300HF standard, est un couple conique de 10/37 et même rapports que la Rallye 1,3 818330. Rien d'anormal donc.
Les couples optionnels (7x41, 9x41.....etc) pour usage sportif sont signalés par une plaque en bronze (pincée avec une fixation des 2 demis carters a proximité du levier d'embrayage)
Cordialement
Gil
Lancia Club France