1.2 HF for sale

Ralph deMasi · Unread post by **Ralph deMasi** » 02 Apr 2009, 04:45

There's a supposed 1.2 HF for sale on the U.S. Ebay item no. 300303828435

It's hard to tell from the engine bay photos but shouldn't it have an oil cooler?

Ed Levin · Unread post by **Ed Levin** » 02 Apr 2009, 05:10

The eBay photo show a correct chassis plate for a 1.2HF, and I provisionally have the car as a correct 1.2HF in the Fulvia register (I've known about it for a couple of years, but I've never actually seen it). But those same photos show an engine with some incorrect details; there should be an oil cooler and the giallo-blu-giallo valve cover, among other things. So the jury's still out on that. I'm planning on taking a look in person over the weekend, and I'll see if I can confirm the correct engine type..

ncundy · Unread post by **ncundy** » 02 Apr 2009, 09:19

Ed,
1.2 HF's did not have oil coolers.

The technical specs at the back of Altorio's book specifically mention oil coolers when they are fitted to a model, they are not mentioned on for the 1.2HF. The TAVs show it more clearly. The 1.2 HF had a different oil filter base to those fitted to the 1.3HF and the 1.6HF. It had no drillings for the cooler thrmostat. The cooler is quite clearly listed as being used on the 1.3HF and 1.6HF only.
Also there are no tags welded on to the inner arch to restrain the oil cooler pipes, as there are on those with it fitted.

For the valve cover painting I am not sure. When you have look at it also check the back axle, according to the TAVs it is the same as the 1.3 HF which means it should have aluminium ends. It should also have a serial number plate on it so you can cross reference the part number.

If you look through the TAVs you will doubtless find other areas of difference that you can check so that you can give your stamp of approval to it.

Neil

adan figueroa · Unread post by **adan figueroa** » 03 Apr 2009, 06:18

Ralph deMasi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There's a supposed 1.2 HF for sale on the U.S.
> Ebay item no. 300303828435
>
> It's hard to tell from the engine bay photos but
> shouldn't it have an oil cooler?

Well I guess will go together, ED has anyone seen for how much one sold lately

ekranoplan · Unread post by **ekranoplan** » 03 Apr 2009, 19:33

B) looks fun!

Horrible seats and not sure steering wheel is correct for HF.

But worth a look

Best

L

Geoff · Unread post by **Geoff** » 03 Apr 2009, 20:00

I saw the car a couple of years ago, and was charmed for a bit. Something really neat historically about it, but of course the seats.....

On the other hand, its power/weight isn't really any better than Rallye 1.3S, so one might wonder if its really worth anything more.

Ralph deMasi · Unread post by **Ralph deMasi** » 04 Apr 2009, 16:38

I would argue that it is more valuable due to only 435 having been made, even if the performance is equal to the 1.3S. This total is the least made, by one half and one third, of the three 1st Series HF models built.

Of course the worth will be dependent on it having the correct 140 motor. The tricky part will be finding the proper seats and sourcing a 1st Series steering wheel. Even then the eventual value will not justify a proper restoration but hey, what's money anyway.

It would be the perfect car to go barking around the California canyons.

Ed Levin · Unread post by **Ed Levin** » 05 Apr 2009, 04:16

I never said it wasn't more valuable than a standard 1.3S--just that the performance is roughly the same. And it is indeed the rarest of the HF. But rarity and value aren't necessarily the same thing (10-year old dog turds are extremely rare, but not worth much).

Restoration would actually be pretty straightforward. 1st Series steering wheels aren't that hard to find, and I've seen a few sets of lightweight seats on eBay over the years. From a economic standpoint, though, this could only make sense if you wanted to hang onto it long term. With the restoration costs you'd be upside down, and it might be a while before the market catches up. And all that assumes that the motor is correct; I'll let you know about that tomorrow, after I see the car.

All that said, I do hope that someone takes it on as a project; staggering value or not, a car this rare deserves to be restored and put back on the road. But maybe not for SoCal canyon runs; it'd be fine on the downhill runs, but it's a little short on grunt for the uphill stretches.

Geoff · Unread post by **Geoff** » 05 Apr 2009, 15:11

grunt is relative. Next time you're in Chicago, Ed, a ride in a 1.1 Appia will revise your view of the world.

I once had the chance to spend an afternoon driving a 1929 Alfa Romeo 1500 Zagato around the mountains of Colorado. It was a most beautiful car, but short of power, to be sure. I think it had about the same power as the Appia does now....

We were doing about 10-15 mph for some of the major mountains going up, but boy, the 70 mph coming down was wonderful. The man in charge of the car,Tom Milton, wouldn't let me use the brakes, and taught me how to drift this wonderful ancient beast around all the corners on those vintage skinny tires. Hard to imagine more fun!

NMLancia · Unread post by **NMLancia** » 05 Apr 2009, 18:10

Waiting to hear the full report from Ed and Adan

Now Ed regarding your "downhill" comment, we can't all have 1.6 HFs. Certianly the "lesser" Fulvia's were designed to go up the Apennines as well as down. Leo Cella placed 11th overall in the 1966 Targa Florio driving a 1.3 HF, I'm sure those roads are a match for the wonderful canyons of SoCal

1.2 HF for sale

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