S1 Gearbox 4 speed problem - Third gear jump

[racing]

great post and information about the gearbox.

Thanks a lot to Huib and khrell

regards Andreas

[marnix]

The long gear shift lever "falling out" of gear in third is not uncommon. The lever has quite some weight in the end, and pulls it out of gear. Something to check is the big bolt/nut that fixes the lever under the protection rubber boot in the cabin. It is a bolt with self locking nut. The idea with the self locking nut is you can tighten it to just give enough friction on the lever to not fall down due to the weight of the long lever. Often the friction got down insufficiently to hold the lever up due to a bit of wear. Tightening the nut very slightly (not hard or the lever will be locked!) usually fixes the problem, unless there is something really wrong in the gearbox itself.

[khrell]

About the 2nd gear. There is a trick to make it shift faster even when cold. I keep it secret because if you shift quicker all the time the wear goes up.

I use the Millers CRX75W90 Synth oil for the gearbox. This already should make it shift a lot faster when cold.

Thank you Huib, this is pure gold.

And thank you all for your advice, these posts are very instructive.

[khrell]

The long gear shift lever "falling out" of gear in third is not uncommon. The lever has quite some weight in the end, and pulls it out of gear. Something to check is the big bolt/nut that fixes the lever under the protection rubber boot in the cabin. It is a bolt with self locking nut. The idea with the self locking nut is you can tighten it to just give enough friction on the lever to not fall down due to the weight of the long lever. Often the friction got down insufficiently to hold the lever up due to a bit of wear. Tightening the nut very slightly (not hard or the lever will be locked!) usually fixes the problem, unless there is something really wrong in the gearbox itself.

Thanks Marnix, that's the first thing I did. It improved somewhat, but obviously the fault is, as Huib says, in having mounted the displacement cone backwards. Now it's time to open and correct it. But your advice is very good

[khrell]

Every time the box is made, is it advisable to change the synchronizers?

[Huib]

Not at all. The Lancia gearboxes are very good. Often the synchros are like new.

Measure the play E. If it is more than 1,1 mm, the synchro is new. If it is 0,5 or less than it has worn and needs to be replaced. Note, I mark the synchros so I can put them back in the original gear.

You can nevertheless play with the synchros. Suppose the one on 2nd is 0,8 and the top one (nr 4) still is 1,3 than swapping them is an option. Apparently the one on 4th does not wear. Putting a 0,8 one is thus no problem. And you can put a "new" one on 2nd.

[khrell]

Valuable information. Thanks Huib, with this data I am going to work on the box, I will tell you the results at the end. Hugs!

[Huib]

Have fun.
And use Millers CRX 75W90 NT+

NT means nano technology. Ultra modern additives.

Do not use the LS (limited slip) version.

[racing]

Yesterday I remembered that the second seal was already a topic in the German forum two years ago.
You can find what you need here in the pictures.

Regards Andreas

[gcarenini]

Ciao Huib!

I just read the post (see above...) were you wrote:
"...You can nevertheless play with the synchros. Suppose the one on 2nd is 0,8 and the top one (nr 4)
still is 1,3 than swapping them is an option. Apparently the one on 4th does not wear. Putting a 0,8 one is thus no problem.
And you can put a "new" one on 2nd."
Checking on the various part books I've found, as usual, many modifications:

parts book Fulvia S1 edition 1976
Cone 1st pn 2284496
cone 2nd pn 2284496
cone 3rd pn 2284496
cone 4th pn 2219018

parts book Fulvia S1 edition 1969
Cone 1st pn 2219015
cone 2nd pn 2219018
cone 3rd pn 2219018
cone 4rt pn 2219018

parts book Flavia S1 edition 1966
Cone 1st pn 2182642
cone 2nd pn 2219018
cone 3rd pn 2188577
cone 4rt pn 2219018

parts book Flavia S1 edition 1971
Cone 1st pn 2219015
cone 2nd pn 2219018
cone 3rd pn 2219018
cone 4rt pn 2219018

No doubts for the cone for 4th gear, that is the same on all the manuals but I was wondering about the differences between the various cones because on the last version of parts books I can understand that the pn 2284496 is compatible with 2219018 and also with 2219015 then finally with all previously indicated cones.
What you think about the fact they not indicated the same cone for all the gears?

Ciao

Giovanni