Hello all. I have recently purchased my first '67 Fulvia Coupe. I'm considering a couple of additions/modifications. My first question is regarding shocks. What are the options/available and the pros/cons of each.
I'm also considering getting a set of alloys for my car. I understand the alloys are wider and can foul the wheel arches. Anyone have any experience with this?
Lastly, how are the parts sources for these cars? Any necessary parts that are unavailable? thanks all.
Dan
New Fulvia coupe
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Huib Geurink
Re: New Fulvia coupe
I am having the original shocks remade.
They are available on www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm
Note that you should not put new shocks if the springs are tired. Shocks will go bad quickly. Do not use shocks to compensate for bad springs. They both have very different functions.
Although the handling of the S1 coupes is best with the original steel wheels and 145x14 tires, some want to change these for alloys.
With 6J13 wheels with 165x13 tires and new, stiffer springs you will be all right after flattening the weld seam of the wheelarches and lengthening the rubber buffer at the rear with 6 cm.
Before putting 13" wheels on make sure they don't cut through the brake lines and don't interfere with the handbrake pinchers.
They are available on www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm
Note that you should not put new shocks if the springs are tired. Shocks will go bad quickly. Do not use shocks to compensate for bad springs. They both have very different functions.
Although the handling of the S1 coupes is best with the original steel wheels and 145x14 tires, some want to change these for alloys.
With 6J13 wheels with 165x13 tires and new, stiffer springs you will be all right after flattening the weld seam of the wheelarches and lengthening the rubber buffer at the rear with 6 cm.
Before putting 13" wheels on make sure they don't cut through the brake lines and don't interfere with the handbrake pinchers.
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P. de R. Leclercq
Re: New Fulvia coupe
Congratulations; I am sure that you will not regret your purchase.
As for parts, this is a big subject. If you look over this site, you will see that some resourceful individuals and companies are re-manufacturing parts.
Such items as ball joints and track-rod ends can be found easily. Water pumps are not too difficult. Gasket sets, no problem.
S1 brake discs seem to last forever... which is more than can be said for the terrible Dunlop brakes. The only permanent solution for this is to line the cylinders with stainless steel - I have this on my 1967-based special where I have retained the Dunlop rear brakes at the rear. The master cylinders are another problem. Whilst the repair kits are available, being aluminium they do wear - usually at the pedal end which controls the front brakes. Again, these can be lined with stainless steel which is a permanent solution, although you could also use a different master cylinder if you are not concerned about originality - I am using one from a FIAT Regata which is 19mm rather than 18mm. This meant the making of an adaptor plate and new push rod.
Exhaust systems - decent ones anyway - are not so easy. Some of the specialist exhaust people will make you a stainless steel system, but again quality (and prices!) do vary. A S1 car will go slightly better with the S2 system fitted owing to the bigger bore.
Marelli distributor caps are becoming hard to find. In fact I suggest that if you can find one, then the Ducellier distributor from the 1969/70 1.3S would be a good investment, since all the parts are easy to get being similar to various Renaults etc. I have one ready for my 1971 Berline!
Engine bearings are becoming rare. Vandervell stopped making them years ago. VP2 material (Copper-backed lead-indium) was specified for the Fulvia. Federal Mogul did (does??) make Fulvia bearings but these are reticular tin which is inferior material. There was a firm called Nuovo Botto in Italy that made lead-indium bearings for Fulvias but I cannot trace them any longer.
Fortunately, there are plenty of 1300 spares around, particularly engines, and sometimes second-hand bearings can be found. The centre main bearing is the big problem as this wears much more than the other two. I have cured a number of engines of low oil pressure by simply replacing the lower centre main shell. However, this main supplies the two adjacent big-ends so I take care to check these at the same time.
Best wishes
Paul
As for parts, this is a big subject. If you look over this site, you will see that some resourceful individuals and companies are re-manufacturing parts.
Such items as ball joints and track-rod ends can be found easily. Water pumps are not too difficult. Gasket sets, no problem.
S1 brake discs seem to last forever... which is more than can be said for the terrible Dunlop brakes. The only permanent solution for this is to line the cylinders with stainless steel - I have this on my 1967-based special where I have retained the Dunlop rear brakes at the rear. The master cylinders are another problem. Whilst the repair kits are available, being aluminium they do wear - usually at the pedal end which controls the front brakes. Again, these can be lined with stainless steel which is a permanent solution, although you could also use a different master cylinder if you are not concerned about originality - I am using one from a FIAT Regata which is 19mm rather than 18mm. This meant the making of an adaptor plate and new push rod.
Exhaust systems - decent ones anyway - are not so easy. Some of the specialist exhaust people will make you a stainless steel system, but again quality (and prices!) do vary. A S1 car will go slightly better with the S2 system fitted owing to the bigger bore.
Marelli distributor caps are becoming hard to find. In fact I suggest that if you can find one, then the Ducellier distributor from the 1969/70 1.3S would be a good investment, since all the parts are easy to get being similar to various Renaults etc. I have one ready for my 1971 Berline!
Engine bearings are becoming rare. Vandervell stopped making them years ago. VP2 material (Copper-backed lead-indium) was specified for the Fulvia. Federal Mogul did (does??) make Fulvia bearings but these are reticular tin which is inferior material. There was a firm called Nuovo Botto in Italy that made lead-indium bearings for Fulvias but I cannot trace them any longer.
Fortunately, there are plenty of 1300 spares around, particularly engines, and sometimes second-hand bearings can be found. The centre main bearing is the big problem as this wears much more than the other two. I have cured a number of engines of low oil pressure by simply replacing the lower centre main shell. However, this main supplies the two adjacent big-ends so I take care to check these at the same time.
Best wishes
Paul
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Jim
Re: New Fulvia coupe
Dan - watch out if you fit adjustable shocks. I reckon that if these are set very stiff, they tend to stress the bodywork around the A and C posts and can cause hairline cracks at the bottom of the windows.
Be careful!
Be careful!
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Huib Geurink
Stiff shocks
Quite interesting information. Looks very well possible to me.
Quite a few Fulvia's run on shocks which are much too stiff. Just the other day I had a discussion about this with my "old Lancia dealer". Very good technical person and a pleasure to talke to him occasionally about the "old times" of the 60's. This dealer was based in Rotterdam and at that time the largest dealer in the Netherlands. Since the KONI factory is just south of Rotterdam, quite a few Lancisti wanted KONI's. Perhaps for patriotic reasons because they never performed very well under Fulvia's and Flavia's, even when set to the least stiff position. They were always too stiff. Often the mounting bracket at the top of the rear shocks was even torn off the body.
The adjustment on low and medium priced shocks is for the expansion stroke only. If the expansion stroke is set too stiff, the wheel does not get enough time to go down on a series of bumps (e.g. cobblestones). A sort of peak rectification of the bumps where the shockabsorber functions as the mechanical equivalent of a diode. In extreme cases the car may end up riding on its bump stops.
I understand the adjustability was invented for hydraulic shocks to compensate for variation in viscosity of the oil as a function of temperature. It is now used as a sales argument by some companies. They say the shocks can be readjusted when the damping decreases over time and distance so that the shocks maintain their original characteristics.
I have never been able to understand this as the adjustement is only for the expansion (or rebound) stroke. And also there is the practical problem of dismounting the adjustable shocks, take them to a machine where one can measure the damping, adjust the damping to the right value, make sure left and right are equal and putting them back. It is much more practical and probably also cheaper to have non adjustable shocks which are exactly right and just change them when they go bad.
Some years ago I also tried to compensate weak springs with stiffer shocks. Does not work at all. The functions of springs and shocks are totally different and should not be confused.
Fortunately I can still have the original De Carbon shocks remade and have large stock. They are available at www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm.
Quite a few Fulvia's run on shocks which are much too stiff. Just the other day I had a discussion about this with my "old Lancia dealer". Very good technical person and a pleasure to talke to him occasionally about the "old times" of the 60's. This dealer was based in Rotterdam and at that time the largest dealer in the Netherlands. Since the KONI factory is just south of Rotterdam, quite a few Lancisti wanted KONI's. Perhaps for patriotic reasons because they never performed very well under Fulvia's and Flavia's, even when set to the least stiff position. They were always too stiff. Often the mounting bracket at the top of the rear shocks was even torn off the body.
The adjustment on low and medium priced shocks is for the expansion stroke only. If the expansion stroke is set too stiff, the wheel does not get enough time to go down on a series of bumps (e.g. cobblestones). A sort of peak rectification of the bumps where the shockabsorber functions as the mechanical equivalent of a diode. In extreme cases the car may end up riding on its bump stops.
I understand the adjustability was invented for hydraulic shocks to compensate for variation in viscosity of the oil as a function of temperature. It is now used as a sales argument by some companies. They say the shocks can be readjusted when the damping decreases over time and distance so that the shocks maintain their original characteristics.
I have never been able to understand this as the adjustement is only for the expansion (or rebound) stroke. And also there is the practical problem of dismounting the adjustable shocks, take them to a machine where one can measure the damping, adjust the damping to the right value, make sure left and right are equal and putting them back. It is much more practical and probably also cheaper to have non adjustable shocks which are exactly right and just change them when they go bad.
Some years ago I also tried to compensate weak springs with stiffer shocks. Does not work at all. The functions of springs and shocks are totally different and should not be confused.
Fortunately I can still have the original De Carbon shocks remade and have large stock. They are available at www.viva-lancia.com/huib/coll/de-carbon.htm.