International Lancia Forums

Hello,

I have a 2.8 GT with the VIN 8241421020. The VIN plate says that the car is a cabriolet, but it is not. The car is titled as a 1962, but I'm not sure if that's accurate.

My question is, how feasible would it be to turn the car into a cabriolet? Paint and a bit of bodywork are next on my agenda anyhow, and this would be a good time to do it.

Steve Read

You have a phony VIN plate on that car. Did you accidentally add a digit to the VIN, because it's got one digit too many.

I'm afraid that the most obvious reason I can think of for a Flaminia to have an incorrect VIN is to mask a stolen car. I really cannot think of any other reason to switch the plate on the car, especially with a plate that identifies a completely different model.

The convertible Touring Flaminia weighs 50 kg MORE than the fixed head GT. This is because of the necessary structural beefing to support to loss of the roof. 50 kg is a LOT of extra meat. It is not feasible to simply cut off the roof of the car to create a convertible. What you will create instead is a parts car.

Are you sure that the car is a 2.8 model? I am assuming that you have an 826 series engine in the car. It is very easy to do an engine switch because the main castings are the same. The transaxle will also be identified with an 826 series plate if it comes from a 2.8 car. Of course, those can be switched too but my guess is that fewer people would bother with that change. So I suggest that you check the number on the transaxle. It's on the driver's side (on a LHD model). I guess I shouldn't assume anything--does your car have triple Weber carburetors?

Are the electrical connectors tube type or blade type. Lancia switched over the blade type connectors somewhere around the end of 1962.

All models of the Flaminia are rare and desirable. The Flaminia GT coupe is one of the more desirable models. Cutting a good one up is inexcusable. A phony convertible will never be worth the value of a real one. It will also never be worth the value of a real GT coupe.

I mistyped the VIN. It is actually 824142102. And it's not phony--I have the orginal bill of sale, and the car has a known and traceable provenance. I also have correspondence from a previous owner in the 70's about the anomaly in the VIN.

Yes, I know it's a 2.8. I measured the cylinders. And yes, it has the triple Weber carbs.

Excuse me for asking a question. It won't happen again.

Steve Read

Steve,

According to the "bible": Sergio Puttini's book "Lancia Fulvia Flavia Flaminia"
a 3C 2.8 Flaminia Convertible VIN starts with 826.134 when it is left hand drive and 826.135 if it is right hand drive the last 4 digits give the car number which on the 3C convertible run from 1001 to 1180
built 1963-64

According to the same Mr Puttini the VIN number 824.14 denotes a 3C 2.5 engined convertible while the last 4 digits indicating the car number run from 2001 to 2246. (built 1961-1963)
There is no VIN for Right hand drive cars

Although it is pretty rare, the Convertible was available with a removeable hard top.
maybe a stupid question , but could it be that somebody bolted on the hardtop after the softtop was worn out ?

By the way, Sergio Puttinis book is currently available in reprint
it is edited by Nada in Milano

Bert

Hi Steve,


I have rebuilt a couple of original convertibiles (including a Flaminia 2.8) and it was a really difficult job to get the body rigid. It will be even more difficult to achieve a good result when taking a GT as a basis.

As far as I know the original convertibiles have a lower windscreen (2 cm) compared to the GT. Furthermore it is almost impossible to manufacture the rods for the soft top when you do not have a reference sample. When you have a look at the back screen area, you will see that some aluminium work will be necessary there to get the end right, and you will have to build the softtop compartment.

Everything is possible, but not everything does make sense. Anyhow, if you need a challenge, good luck.


Hubert

You and the really good body shop I use have convinced me not to do it.

Thanks.

Bert--

I'm not sure what the real story is. The original owner is deceased, but I have a call in to the second owner to see if I can get more details. I've pulled all the upholstery from the rear compartment. It shows no signs of a top having been welded on, or of any soft top mechanism or mounting points (not having a cabriolet to look at, I'm not sure what I'm looking for, but I sure don't see anything).

I have determined that it got the 2.8 engine very early in its life (some time in the first two years, it seems).

I suspect that the chassis was pressed into service as a coupé, and the VIN was not changed. But it is a mystery. I'm positive that the VIN on the car has not changed (I have some of the original owner's notes, which show the engine change).

Steve

Steve,

I checked all other literature that I have, but it remains a mystery
The fact that you have proof of the engine change explains why a 2.5 car has a 2.8 engine, but the mix up of convertible and Coupe VIN is hard to explain.
I checked the original Touring parts book (didn't I send you a Flaminia CD last year ?, the Touring parts book should be on) and the whole rear section is different between the coupe and the convertible
Makes it inconceivable that somebody has been swaying a welding torch at it.
So it must have happened in the factory, though if you look at the pictures the convertibles and the coupes ran on separate lines.
The only source that you could try to have the question answered is probably the international Touring register, but they are dead slow in answering, if at all : www.registrotouring.com

best regards,

Bert